Killer of the Flower Moon by David Grann

We had a good size group for discussion on this book, fifteen members were present.

This nonfiction book told the story about the Osage people in Oklahoma and the murders that happened because of their wealth from oil under their land and greed from people like, William Hale, who killed to get the money.

One member said she generally doesn't read nonfiction but liked the historical information and the FBI history in the book.   Instead of listening to the book, as she normally does, she liked the pictures in the book, so enjoyed reading it and learning so much.  But the biggest question to most of the members about the book was "Why wasn't this talked about in history classes in school?" "Why haven't we heard of this more in history?"  "Why was there such a cover-up?"  Native Americans have had a lot to endure, one person commented.  One member said this is the 3rd book club she has  read the book for discussion.  She said it makes me sick what we did to American Indians.  The book was a good history lesson. One person said most in the story were a part of the cover-up, lots of corruption another said, even the doctors.  Another said, "How did this happen and I didn't hear about it -- I am a history buff."  Another agreed, and she has a "high learning curve and had never heard of this, and by comments, most of us here had never heard of this."

A member said she thought it was so well-written, David Grann did a great job pulling it all together and made it as readable as a novel.  "I never read a nonfiction that was a page turner" another agreed and said it was hard to put down.  Some in the group found a video to watch about this, and they found there was so much more about Tom White in the book, verses the video hardly mentioned him at all.  Although some in the group said it was hard to figure out who was who in the book, it was hard to keep the story line straight.

There was a discussion about the FBI and J Edgar Hoover.  Glad that the book covered this.

We talked about the Flower Moon, it is a May moon, when the flowers are just blooming.  We talked about the time the flowers were blooming but were hammered down to earth with the killings.  Each tribe had different names for the Moons. 

The Osage now had money with the oil money -- some had 11 cars.  Someone said that when they wanted a car, they pointed to it and say, I want it that color and pointed to their blankets.  All the cars were black until that time, this was the time cars started to have them painted different colors. 

The Osage weren't being treated as whole human beings someone said through all of this.  They were not given their money, they had to have a "guardian" that had to approve their spending.  They were only able to spend a couple thousand if they could get their money.  If you were married to a white person, they could be your guardian.  But, the Osage were considered the happiest of people, they didn't need money, a member said.

Someone said it was good to read the Native American perspective on this.  Tom White separated the facts, he listened and sorted through hear say and facts.  He was diligent about it.  He was smart, he chose undercover cops.  They were honest.  People were so afraid, even generations after. 

Even after all these murders, Hale was sentenced to prison, not to death, which was the custom of the time.  He was released after a short amount of time, too.  At first Hale gave good first impressions, helpful, a good guy, raised his nephew, he had charisma, but all of these things he needed to do to carry off the murders.  He had the Osage best interest at heart (they thought) so they trusted him.  He betrayed them.  He had the politicians in his pocket, and if he didn't they were afraid of him.  It was so easy to poison those he murdered.  There was no coroner, no evidence, you found out days later, the doctors were corrupt, there was no oversights. Everyone was corrupt.

We talked about Oklahoma and the Osage Indians.  There are 5 million Native American and 78% live outside reservations someone said.  Someone said there was a National Cowboy & Western Heritage Museum in Oklahoma City that is worth seeing, too. 

New Boy by Tracy Chevalier

April 2019 New Boy by Tracy Chevalier was a novelty read for us, with 14 members in attendance.  Our leader for this month's book had heard of a new project from Hogarth Press, a Shakespeare project that is found on this link, click here.  The information states: "Shakespeare's works have been performed, read, and loved throughout the world. They have been reinterpreted for each new generation, whether as a teen films, musicals, science-fiction flicks, Japanese warrior tales, or literary transformations. The Hogarth Press was founded by Virginia and Leonard Woolf in 1917 with a mission to publish the best new writing of the age.  In 2012, Hogarth was launched in London and New York to continue the tradition.  The Hogarth Shakespeare project sees Shakespeare's works retold by acclaimed and bestselling novelists of today.  The series launched in October 2015 and to date will be published in twenty countries." 

So, we were part of this history of reading at least one of the books in the series.  The other books written so far were: The Gap of Time, Shylock is My Name, Vinegar Girl, Hagseed, Dunbar and Macbeth.  The day of our book club meeting was Shakespeare's birthday, and the date of his death!

As we shared what we felt about the book, many of the members had never read Othello, or if they had it had been a few years.  So many did some research and read a little about the story.  One member said she could see, very well see, the similarities of Othello.  One member noted that each of the characters names started with the same letter as the original Othello, so similarities with the characters. "It was kind of dark."  someone said, which it was and the story of Othello was dark.  Another added the ending "surprised me."   "How can such a good person spiral down so fast."

One member had a good thought. She knew the storyline, and wondered how is it going to play out.  With all the school shootings, would it go that direction.  It did not and she was thankful it didn't.  The kids were very socially involved in the end, all in one day.  It was not realistic that they had that emotional connection in one day!  Set in the 70's this story would have been different now, someone said, with all the phones they probably are using. A text would have been sent that said they had the pencil pouch!

Another member said it started out subtly and overt, but found that the things they were doing were not things that I would have seen 6th graders do, maybe 9th graders, but not 6th grade (this comment coming from a retired Elementary Teacher).   One member said she thought the kids talked more like adults than the 6th graders that they were.   In reference to Ian, a member said, "one bad apple wrecks the whole bunch."

It was a short and easy read, the setting of the story all in one day, "how many recesses do they get!"  As a new student in school, things progressed rather quickly for the story to come out.  A member related her story of going to new schools, as farmers back in the day moved from farm to farm, she wasn't picked on like "O" was, but more "ignored."  So the story had a good start to it.

We talked about the racism of the teachers.  The one teacher, was very racist towards "O".  He kept expecting the worst from him, even because of his skin color.  Would this happen now?  We thought this was happening at that time.   We were sad to read it happened in New York to "O", even with doormen watching him go past buildings.

Character comparison:  New Boy - Othello

Osei - Othello  Both in love with Dee & Desmenona; Both girls white and both boys were black; Both friended by popular girls.  We talked about O's death -- did he really die?  Most interpreted he did die.
Dee - Desmenona  We thought the girls had a bigger role in New Boy, we were able to see the play through their eyes.  Quite the language -- called a girl a whore and yet they are playing double dutch jump rope. 
Casper - Cassio Was a good kid, the bad outweighs the good.
Ian - Iago  Both bad guys.  We felt that Ian probably didn't have the best home life.  He had learned fear so he gave fear to others.  "Hold your friends close but your enemies closer" applies here!  Ian was a social path -- he is terrifying.  Even the teachers couldn't rein him in.  They couldn't do anything about him it seemed.  There was more unrest in Ian's wake, it had a ripple effect.
Mimi - Emilia
Rod - Roderigo
Mr. Brabant - Brabantio
Blanca - Bianca

Someone said that Shakespeare was drama.  He was presenting ideas, like jealousy.  He didn't mean for it to be real.  Sheakespeare was taken after a real event, probably a muslim/moors event and probably prejudice at that time. 

We talked about Osei bringing up his sister and the Black Power, Black Panther's.  Was there a lot of racism in this or was it more about the bullying?  We still have the bullying in school.  This happened years ago too, Irish, Polish, different nationalities in the area where we lived.  This seems to have repeated itself from Shakespears time to our time, human nature repeating itself.   Is this about race or a means to an end?  What would it be like with out race, perhaps more bullying? 

My Grandmother Asked Me to Tell You She's Sorry by Fredrik Backman

March 2019 - Thirteen members gathered to talk about My Grandmother Asked Me To Tell You She's Sorry by Fredrik Backman.   Some of us in book club have read a Man Called Ove, so we had a little history in reading one of his novels.  Many of us stated that it was very hard at first, we weren't sure we could get through the book.  But, by a third of the way in, I believe, most of us were ready to continue on that adventure and excited to see what happens next.

One member said, "Granny was quite the character and I enjoyed the other characters the author created through out the book.  I enjoyed learning about the characters through the scavenger hunt that Granny had Elsa go through.  They were great lessons."  We talked quite a bit about Granny.  In the novel it shares that Granny failed as a mother but thrived as Grandma! And she really did, we agreed.   One member said it made her cry, "I never had a Grandma like that.  Hard to experience because I never had a Grandma like that."  So we talked about our Grandma's in relation to how Elsa's Granny was.  Someone asked, what stories have you told your kids?  Are you a story teller like Granny?  One member said she has told her grandkids stories when she goes to visit them, weaves the story with their location and adds bits and pieces.  Granny had told Elsa these stories but she also told her mother the stories when she was little, she told the policewoman with the green eyes too.

Granny and her daughter Ulrika were so different, such opposites.  Granny was a doctor and had a larger mission we talked about, she saved many lives and continued to save many lives, those around her.  Granny was a free spirit, her daughter, very orderly.  Granny was the one you brought to war.  Granny was a heroine to so many in the book.  The residents, the policewoman in the green eyes and the others at the funeral.  Granny won the apartment building in a poker game and we laughed about Granny being a "playboy" and Elsa asking Alf if they were ever an item!!!

She wanted Elsa to know that all the people you meet will keep you safe, just like Granny had done for her.  "Every 7 year old deserves a hero," one member said.  "We need a hero, someone who asks us to transform, to challenge us, to come in and out of our lives, a gift from God.  It will be nice tell someone you are a hero."  Someone said the new TV series, "The Village" reminds her of this, they are all interconnected in some way in that apartment, all a part of each other's lives.  The people in Granny's building were there to help you, to love you, to protect you when you are in sadness, pain, fear and loss.  They were your support system.

Granny had this planned out for Elsa to follow.  She had even planted the stroller in the front of the apartment, but we figured Britt-Marie made the puzzle for Elsa to figure it out.  We enjoyed learning more about the kingdoms and the explanation as the letter deliveries went on.  It made sense to us then, it all came together, many were intertwined.  These were the kingdoms we found page 228 -- the kingdoms in the Land-of-Almost-Awake:

Miamas -- I love
Miploris -- I mourn
Mirevas -- I dream
Miaudacas - I dare
Mimovas - I dance
Mibatalos - I fight

We struggled with all the fantasy kingdoms, but we agreed we liked the explanation of the kingdoms and agreed this must have been in Wolfhearts native language, perhaps Croatian or Bosnian, since he was part of a conflict in that area we felt.  Was this the secret language they used?  We found that Granny started telling the stories to Elsa when her parents went through a divorce, the first kingdom was about love.

We talked about Britt-Marie and found there is a follow-up novel, that a few had read, saying they would highly recommend it. "That woman needed change" someone said, and that her quirky character fit the book.  We found out that Britt-Marie helped to "raise" Ulrika  -- we noted how she always said her name when she talked to her. There was that connection, but we didn't know why that was until at the end.  We understood why Ulrika is organized, because Britt-Marie was organized.  She was a rule follower and rule maker, and she probably had influence on Ulrika with this.  She took control of what she could take control of.  Like when her husband (we found out later) was having an affair, she had him come home right away and put his shirt in the laundry.  She didn't want to smell that woman's perfume.  But we had no idea why it was her rule to put that shirt in the laundry right away, not until the end.  Elsa asked Britt-Marie why do you move the razor around -- I like to hear him say my name, she replied.  We understood at the end.

We talked about Ulkea and how she wanted to be there for Elsa, she wanted to show Elsa she trusted her, gave her independence though too.  We felt she could have smothered her, with what she went through with her mother, but she didn't.

The other characters in the story were so interesting.  Who was feeding the wurse?  Granny went in hospital so she sent Elsa home to give it chocolate!  We figured out that dog had it's own apartment!   Someone asked what kind of dog did you imagine him to be?  Some said Rottweiler, lab, part hound, and someone said New Foundland dog, full of lots of hair!  Wolfheart was an interesting character.  We were glad he came back New Years Day and was not charged with a crime in saving them from Sam.  Alf & Kent, we find out later were brothers, who were both fighting for the princess, Britt-Marie, but Ken won and it should have been Alf!  Len & Maud were characters that were the parents of Sam, who Granny had met and actually was saved by Wolfheart in the war.  Len & Maud's son, their grandson, helped the Lady in Black Skirt, who had a happy ending in the book, we liked that.  We felt Elsa really helped her.  Marcel - funny, was an accountant, a doctor, a lawyer, a priest!

Harry Potter was one of Elsa's favorite books.  It helped piece together the timeline as we read that Granny used some of that in her stories.  Interestingly at the end, Elsa's Dad had Harry Potter on the radio, that he was listening to the story.  We talked about some of the stories that we read when we were growing up, "the Happy Holisters," "Encyclopedia Brown" "Little House on the Priairie." "Lord of the Rings."

Elsa had some trouble in school, but through stories, through Granny's stories, she survived.  At the end Granny says to her:  "Promise you won't hate me when you find out who I've been.  And promise me you'll protect the castle.  Protect your friends."  We liked how the story wove through those int he building and they were all to protect each other. A few had commented that we thought this would be a great movie, and it would be interesting, now to go back and read it again, as we understood a little better what this all meant!

***I found this link, that explained the characters of the book.  I wish I would have had it before I started reading. If you are interested, click here to see the list!

Little Fires Everywhere by Celeste Ng

February 2019 - Most of us realized after reading this book that we would have a great discussion of all the different aspects and we did!  There were ten of us for discussion.  It was a very well-liked book!

One member said off the bat, that she loved this book as it was different, it was a book that was more modern, in today's world.  She said every neighbor has a neighbor who shakes it up and she (Mia) would be an asset to the community.  Someone said "Thought the book did a good job of making the adults and the teenagers real. With the kids, you could feel like you were that age again."   Another said "the book starts with the house on fire, interesting start!"  We said many questions were raised, birth parents, adoption, relationships with mothers.

We talked about the relationship between Izzy and Elena (Mrs. Richardson).  Someone shared they felt that anger is the bodyguard of fear.  That since Izzy's birth, there has been this fear, which manifests itself in anger in Mrs. Richardson.  There were things that Izzy did that were very much like her mother.  "The things we dislike most in others are the characteristics we like least in ourselves." - Marian Keyes (Rachel's Holiday).  We talked of our own relationship with our mothers and that perhaps, in the book, Izzy was a "spirited child."

Mia and Pearl had a very close relationship.  Pearl being an only child, liked the activity at the Richardson's home, especially after moving around forever and never having a connection to others.  The focus wasn't just on Pearl, as she had with Mia, as an only child. We wondered, if Pearl was not happy when her mother took the job at the Richardson's, having her mother there often, in the space she so enjoyed.  She had freedom at the Richardsons, and now that changed with her mom there, watching.  Someone said they, Mia & Pearl, lived in 46 different cities.  She finished projects and moved and yet she recognized Pearl's need to stay in one place.  When the time came for them to leave again, we wondered why Pearl didn't tell her mother she was going to stay.  She could have chosen to not go with her mom.

What constitutes a mother, bringing up the adoption issue.  There was discussion, that some parents that are adoptive parents can make it work, others can't.  Linda McCullough would have made it work, we felt.   BeBe realized that, after a short time, she wanted May Ling/Mirabelle back.  She loved that baby so much, but she was in need of so much help, and she did tell the police she wanted her baby back, but was not heard.  She didn't know where to get help.  We talked about what qualifies a parent to parent, what constitutes a mother?  We also talked about Mia leaving with Pearl, not telling the Ryan's that she had the baby.

We brought up the court case of Baby Jessica, click here for more info, as this was a real life instance similar to this situation.  With this case, the mother realized in 5 days she wanted her baby back.  Someone said they wished that they could have split the custody, but this wasn't an open adoption.  Very hard for both mothers.

When the fire happened, and Izzy left, we talked about the change in Mrs. Richardson, especially towards Izzy.  The others didn't really care where Izzy was, but Mrs. Richardson did. She would find her. She was a detective reporter, she knew where to get help, look at all she did to find out Mia's past.  We thought the artwork of Mia, that was left behind for Mrs. Richardson was very good analogy of her life, was she the bird in the cage?  Or was that Izzy?  We felt that there was a change now in Mrs. Richardson because of what they just went through.  We saw that change, a mothering change in Mrs. Richardson.

We talked about some of the connection to the title of the book -- Little Fires Everywhere.

When BeBe is crying at Mia's house and Izzy stops over, Izzy asks "But is she going to be okay?"  Mia answers "I don't know, honestly. But she will. Sometimes, just when you think everything is gone, you find a way." Mia racked her mind for an explanation.  "Like after a prairie fire.  I saw one years ago, when we were in Nebraska.  It seems like the end of the world.  The earth is all scorched and black and everything green is gone.  But after the burning the soil is richer and new things can grow."  She held Izzy at arm's length, wiped her cheek with a fingertip, smoothed her hair one last time.  "People are like that, too, you know.  They start over.  They find a way."  (Chapter 18)

Mrs. Richardson was reflecting on her life "All her life, she had learned that passion, like fire, was a dangerous thing.  It so easily went out of control.  It scaled walls and jumped over trenches.  Sparks leapt like fleas and spread as rapidly; a breeze could carry embers for miles.  Better to control that spark and pass it carefully from one generation to the next, like an Olympic torch.  Or perhaps, to tend it carefully, like an eternal flame:  a reminder of light and goodness that would never -- could never -- set anything ablaze. Carefully controlled.  Domesticated.  Happy in captivity.  The key, she thought, was to avoid conflagration." (Chapter 11)

We discussed the "little fires everywhere" and these two instances were noted in the book.  It was a great title for the book.  We talked briefly about the pregnancy of Elena (Mrs. Richardson's own daughter) that Mia knew about.  Elena thought it was Pearl, but it was really Lexie, Elena's own daughter who had gotten pregnant and then abortion.  She thought it was Moody, who had been the  father, but it was Tripp.  We never did hear the final resolution with this issue.  Did she find out who really had been pregnant?  There were unanswered questions at the end of the book, including did Elena find Izzy?  Did Pearl go back with her Mom to see her grandparents.  Would they find the Ryan's, as Joseph Ryan was her biological father (we thought that was interesting how he pursued her because she looked so much like his wife).  And had Elena changed, would she become a "mother" to Izzy when she found her, as we suspected she would.

Homegoing by Yaa Gyasi

Seven members were available for the January discussion of Homegoing.  The members really liked this book; the storyline and characters were so good.  One person who wasn't at the meeting had said she loved the book and in conclusion added, "A new classic?"

There was so much information in the story, the leader of this book said she recommended it, having listened to it years ago and thought it was just the book for us. She said, she seldom reads a book twice but this one warranted that second read.  "There is so much in here that we just don't know how to connect, no idea how to relate to this."  Many agreed.  Many thought the stories went back and forth and reading it a second time would be great.  It was wonderful to have the family lineage list to follow.  Some people took notes for the book.

Our book club leader asked us something that you hadn't thought of before, something that stood out to us in the book and a few people mentioned that they were surprised by the conflicts with the tribes:  the stealing, the slavery and selling each other.  One person said the English wouldn't have had as much success if there wasn't this conflict between tribes.   This had to do not with survival, but with plain greed, someone said.

The book took us through the lasting effects of slavery.  How at the beginning, we have Maame, who herself was a part of one African tribe who used her, used women, until she ran away and was happy  with Big Man Asare.  She mothered two daughters, one she left behind and their story started to intertwine at the Cape Coast Castle, so close, one above the other, one free, one enslaved.

We talked about the journey the families took, the marriages they had, the children they had, and their journey.  We talked about polygamy in most of the African tribes.  James was the first one that didn't want that life style.  He was the one to change.  The women were strong, being a mother, they had to be strong.  You had to have connections to keep going on.  Some of the men left their families.  The slavery affected families, both in Africa and in America.  Was it better to have stayed in Africa or have gone to America?

We talked about the lasting effects of slavery in America, even with H being "enslaved" at the mines, (convict leasing) not able to pay his way out of prison, and Anna, his mother, a free woman, taken from her family in New York.

We read (on page 175) about Ethe, she was not happy with H, she said that "All I had of her (her mother) was my name. That was all I had of myself too."  We felt that was a powerful statement for the women, too, in this book.

Someone also shared (on page 226) about Yaa talking about history.  "This is the problem of history.  We cannot know that which we were not there to see and hear and experience for ourselves.  We must rely on the words of others...But now we come upon the problem of conflicting stories....Whose story do we believe, then?"  This has been true through out history, and even, now during this time.

Why was the book titled:  Homegoing?  We talked about that, deciding it might have to do with going back home, finally at the end with Marcus meeting Marjorie and both heading back to Ghana.  They both had fears, fire and water, and both helped each other tackle their fear.  The beginning of the book started with the fire and water.  Loved the ending, "Here," Marjorie said." Have it." She lifted the stone from her neck, and placed it around Marcus's.  "Welcome Home."  The very stone that Maame gave to her daughter Effia.

We had a great discussion about this book and looked up the history of the Cape Coast Castle and the country.  We loved the storyline from the author and her own story.  Would be interesting to hear her speak about this book.

Tuesday, December 18 Holiday Gathering

We have changed our reading selection and have chosen to not have a book discussion this month.  We are not at Park Grove Library, this month, instead we are celebrating the Holiday Season together at a local restaurant!  We will return in January.  If you are interested in joining us in December, please connect with the info desk at the library.

The Park Grove Library Book Club meets at 6:30 pm, usually the fourth Tuesday of the month at Park Grove Library, Cottage Grove.  We welcome anyone to join us for the discussion and join our group.

Just a special note to book club members.  Would love to hear your thoughts & opinions on the book club, whether you were at the discussion or not!  Share what you thought about the book.  There is a spot under the post for comments, you can do a few different log-in programs or do it anonymously but feel free to write your name!

The Wangs vs The World by Jade Chang

The Wangs vs. The World carried quite a discussion with 16 members present.   Some felt it was interesting and humorous and others found it frustrating and didn’t want to read further.  One person stated it well:  “It was a tragedy and a comedy.”  Another said, “Having the comedy helped you get through it.” “It was different” was a common description.  It was a story about an immigrant, but it was unlike other stories we have read.  One person added that “it may be a better read for a younger audience.”  Another added that she didn’t like that it didn’t have a cohesive plot.  Another member said that “there were too many subplots.” 

We talked about the characters of the book.  One member said “The characters were flat and I wanted them to come to life a little more.”  Another member said that she “felt there were missed opportunities to develop the characters.  It didn’t feel 100% genuine.  Grace’s character felt inconsistent, very self-centered.”   One member said that she loved the kids, they were all hardworking and smart.  If you didn’t know their names, it could have been any family going through this.

“I liked Charles, he was always dreaming about China and was shocked as to how he was treated when he went back there.”  Another member was frustrated by Charles, saying he didn’t get enough character plot.  We were surprised by Charles strong business intuition and then when the loss came we questioned that, how did he not know how to truly handle the business financially?  We also questioned why he didn’t go back to China before, as he had traveled many times back to that area.  As a plot to the story, we questioned a few of these aspects.  America use to love Charles Wong, and it let him down.  Charles was under the impression that anything was possible in America.  We talked about how he was so insulated as a CEO from the marketing /delivery of his product.  He took product to a customer, and yet it melted in the back of a U-Haul.  He had no clue that it would melt.  We also chuckled that Charles climbed to his business which started with urine, Urea, used for fertilizer and then for make up!  We did talk about his ancestry, which had been very successful.  When his birthright was taken from him, he moved to America to reinvent himself and become successful.  Being the oldest birthright for his family, he would have inherited their land.    We talked about how much Charles loved his children.  We brought up the thought that, if he would have stayed in China, he would not have had 3 children. 

Saina, the oldest, found a way to survive.  She was smart to buy a home in the country after her melt down with the media.  We talked about the art that she had made, how creative it was to use immigrants, and did it possibly have a connection with her father’s story?  All she wanted to do with her art was resonate, someone had said.  The jackets she started with were a quick media idea.  She was very creative and smart. 

We felt the family was dysfunctional.  We talked about Barbra and her staying with Charles.  On the journey across the country, we learned that she was already to leave him, had it all planned and she couldn’t do it.  Deep down she loved him.  We noted that she found out he kept her badge from when they first met, she had left in the cafeteria where she worked.  He had it all these years.  He didn’t love his first wife, but we felt he did love Barbra. 

Andrew was not what his father would like for him to be.  He knew that a stand-up comedian wouldn’t be what would fit his father idea.  But he pursued it.  We talked about that creativity among the characters was a common denominator.   Some felt Andrew was very self-serving.

Some of us felt Grace was also self-centered, but then we had another aspect brought out when she cared for their Ama.  She was the one who was a caring individual. She also was very talented with her blogging.

We talked about the business aspects that were brought out in the book, and the 2008 recession.  It was interesting to read about the Beanie Bag scheme.  A few of us raised our hands when asked if we were buying Beanie Babies at that time!

At the end of the story, they had what was most important, they had each other.   They were truly connected with each other, when their privileged life style didn’t happen.  In the end money they weren’t interested in the money.